Topic: Disappointed

Now that the amazement is over and the Dash is unbricked using the new ChumbyDash has left me disappointed.  The theme is very busy, lots of buttons and the bottom 2/3rds of the screen has nothing I will use.  I would have preferred something like Sony's  5 day weather forecast and time all on one screen.  The current Chumby screen flips between two screens and the 5 day forecast is difficult to read unless you are very close to the device.

I would have been willing to donate something for the effort to get these devices going again. But I don't feel the $3 a month for life is something I will subscribe to.  $36 a year is going to add up.

There are plenty of new weather devices out there that don't need any monthly fees.  I converted one of my old iPad 2's to a weather station when Sony pulled the plug.  A one time $3 app purchase and a $5 stand got me a really nice weather clock for a device that was also past it's prime for daily use. I also purchased a Zettaly a year ago and really enjoy it in my workshop.  Android device, speakers, remote control, music, access to the play store all for $100 bucks.

I'm sorry for the negative post but it's how I am feeling.  I don't like the current screen layout and don't see anything that appealing in the app store to justify a $36 yearly fee.

Re: Disappointed

I also prefer the Sony Dash weather App, its the only reason my wife still used the Dash in the 1st place... I did subscribe, but am looking for a better weather app. The AccuWeather.com Forecast, Weatherbug, and others just aren't up to par with what I am used to... I am staying subscribed because its better than nothing and don't have a better option other than the Amazon Echo Show (maybe)

So kudos for unbricking the Dash, but hoping for more.

Re: Disappointed

While I feel similarly (with the overall layout of the themes available -- non really 'work' for me for what I want), I don't think this is a "Ok, we're done now.  Enjoy your ChumDash!" and no more updates.

I'm set to wait and see how things progress.  I'm hoping in a month or two for a new theme more in line with what I would like. 

If this is what v1.000 looks like it's pretty damn awesome.  If this is all we'll ever get, then yeah...  Disappointed.  However, I'm hoping for continued updates.

Re: Disappointed

Well, you can't please all the people all the time.

The emphasis was, quite rightly, creating and then getting a process "good enough" for public consumption, before people threw all the dashes away. 

Could the public release have been held until it had more themes? Sure.

But people seemed desperate for a chance to get their hands on *SOMETHING* when the code was even less functional than it is now.

What ya gonna do???

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

Re: Disappointed

diamaunt wrote:

What ya gonna do???

Exactly what you did.  It's fine.  And thanks! 

You might want to create a faq or something on the process and continual support/improvements so people don't think "this is all you are going to get" and there will be no more development.   I think there's a lot of "fix my dash" folks here not getting exactly what they had before going "huh...".

Re: Disappointed

diamaunt wrote:

What ya gonna do???

You do what you can in this 140-character short-attention-span society.

Funny thing is the Sony app and theme selection has been nonexistent for almost a year (since the last server crash).  I would like something more like the original Dash default theme but I am willing to wait or write it myself.   If you can't do either then maybe it's time to put your Dash up on eBay.

Re: Disappointed

While I'm not a fan of the three themes currently available, I also understand that Chumby put some serious work into getting these devices working *at all*, with little financial incentive yet. I'm pleased to have a device that functions again, even if it doesn't look exactly the way I'd like it to.

To be honest, I'd just like the basic theme without the antique world map in the background... but I'll be patient and wait until they design more themes, or open up the process to user design.

Re: Disappointed

I have to admit, I didn't expect this thread only three days after the very first release.

For those of you expressing disappointment - I'm curious what your expectations were, and what the basis for those expectations was.  I'd like to know where we got our wires crossed.

Re: Disappointed

Duane wrote:

I have to admit, I didn't expect this thread only three days after the very first release.

For those of you expressing disappointment - I'm curious what your expectations were, and what the basis for those expectations was.  I'd like to know where we got our wires crossed.

My guess is that some people want everything, hand delivered, to be paid for the privilege, and they want it two weeks ago last Thursday.

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

Re: Disappointed

Duane wrote:

I have to admit, I didn't expect this thread only three days after the very first release.

For those of you expressing disappointment - I'm curious what your expectations were, and what the basis for those expectations was.  I'd like to know where we got our wires crossed.

I am actually just happy the Dash is again functional, thanks for that.  I never did use it for Neflix, news, youtube, etc.  I always considered my Asus transformer and laptop for those functions.  I admit I do miss seeing the 5 day weather on the screen of the Dash but smartphones are always within reach with this information.

Your efforts are appreciated.

Re: Disappointed

Duane wrote:

I'd like to know where we got our wires crossed.

I'm happy for a dash that doesn't brick or cycle through trying to authenticate with a sony server that will never answer. 

What I said in my post above:  "If this is what v1.000 looks like it's pretty damn awesome." 

I think there may have been an expectation of getting something more in line with one of the (I think the most popular) sony default themes.  It basically had clock on top, widgets left (large enough to be seen and read from more than 12 inches away), and weather right.

What we have is a single theme that's kind of close to that.  Widget size is far too small to be useful from even a short  distance. 

Remember -- living in Sony World probably tainted expectations. 

I think communicating that this is a process that is still going would be a good idea.

Re: Disappointed

Remember, the device is hackable now.

1) turn on sshd using MENU->Settings->Device Info->pi->SSHD
2) ssh into the device
3) type "cp /usr/widgets/theme.swf /psp; sync"
4) reboot the device

This will cause the Control Panel to attempt to use the "default theme" that's embedded in the firmware.  I have no idea what condition it's in or how well it may or may not work.

To get rid of it, switch the theme using the UI.

Re: Disappointed

jhonryan wrote:

I think communicating that this is a process that is still going would be a good idea.

That has been mentioned multiple times in multiple threads. 

What do you suggest to get that point across?

http://forum.chumby.com/viewtopic.php?id=9843 towards the bottom "What about the future?"

http://forum.chumby.com/viewtopic.php?pid=55891#p55891"at the moment"

http://forum.chumby.com/viewtopic.php?pid=55940#p55940 "not yet, early days"

http://forum.chumby.com/viewtopic.php?id=9856

Probably more, but I'm on a small tablet at the moment and can't search as well as usual, those were just the first that came to hand.

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

Re: Disappointed

diamaunt wrote:
jhonryan wrote:

I think communicating that this is a process that is still going would be a good idea.

That has been mentioned multiple times in multiple threads. 

What do you suggest to get that point across?

I get it.  *I* understood it.  The top two posters of this thread apparently missed it.  I share their disappointment but I know it's still a work in progress.

I suggested letting them know.  I don't think the answer is to post a bunch of links and make them feel stupid.

Maybe it's just me, but I think statements like:

"My guess is that some people want everything, hand delivered, to be paid for the privilege, and they want it two weeks ago last Thursday."

Will only serve to alienate potential paying customers.  Again...  maybe it's just me.

Maybe something like:

"This is an on going process that was started with a drop dead date of July 2017 with little notice.  Dashes are saved and working!  They are still 'smart'!  Expect updates and we welcome suggestions.  Please see the link [here] for more details!"

You might get a few more subscribers.

Re: Disappointed

I realize too, the weather in my kitchen devices i need this.  But for this first firmware it's a Good job
The device in bedroom is working perfectly with graduate light to wake up, schedule advance alarm working good.
But for weather we developed an addiction.  Possibly, in future I purchase a tablet to do that and more.

It a saving expensive trash, it's my environmental kind.

Re: Disappointed

Duane wrote:

I have to admit, I didn't expect this thread only three days after the very first release.

For those of you expressing disappointment - I'm curious what your expectations were, and what the basis for those expectations was.  I'd like to know where we got our wires crossed.

It's just someone who's trying to rationalize being too cheap to pay for the benefit of your work.  Nothing you can do about it except recognize it for what it is.

Re: Disappointed

I also would like to add that I'm very happy this device is now not dead anymore.
I enjoy the challenge of putting something on it that I like myself and I'm glad you guys gave me the opportunity to do exactly that.

A big thank you! And - yes - I subscribed :-D

Cheers,

Alaric11

Re: Disappointed

jhonryan wrote:

Will only serve to alienate potential paying customers.  Again...  maybe it's just me.

Maybe something like:

"This is an on going process that was started with a drop dead date of July 2017 with little notice.  Dashes are saved and working!  They are still 'smart'!  Expect updates and we welcome suggestions.  Please see the link [here] for more details!"

You might get a few more subscribers.

This is my personal opinion, and in no way represents the views of Duane or Blue Octy LLC, and may be deleted if it's out of line, but...

I personally don't agree with the coddling of entitled customers, that are demanding and complain about everything they can.   

Duane bends over backwards to keep the chumbys (and now the dashes) alive and working, and while he'd never say anything that wasn't extremely diplomatic, even in private messages to me, this topic must have been like a punch in the gut after spending over two months of his spare time, away from his family, coding his fingers bloody to save the dashes from the landfill, and save all you folks from the disappointment Sony thouthglessly handed you. 

Again, that's just my personal opinion...

*Goes back in the janitor closet and grabs his mop again*

I hear your dissatisfaction with my comments and appreciate your point.  Thank you.  Please wipe your feet.

--janitor

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

19 (edited by jhonryan 2017-08-09 13:19:40)

Re: Disappointed

diamaunt wrote:

I personally don't agree with the coddling of entitled customers, that are demanding and complain about everything they can.

I took the time to review the top two users post histories and don't see either of them displaying an air of "entitlement" in their posts nor were they demanding and complaining about everything.

I think you may have experienced that with quite a few other users and you are lumping any compliant in to the same "bucket".  I understand why that could happen.  It's like road rage (on a much much smaller scale).  You've been cut off too many times and the next guy to cut you off may have for the first time ever made a stupid mirror check error but gets the anger of 100 traffic incidences focused on them.   It happens when you are encountering 100s of random people  in any environment.  I constantly see it in my field directed at our sales department. 

I just dont see why doing a quick "copy-paste" to a question that may have been answered or addressed elsewhere to someone who may or may not be very technical or may or may not have just stumbled upon chumby.com would be considered "entitled" or "coddling".

Just some feed back.  I hope it's taken in the spirit in which it is given.  Just smile and be happy you guys made a LOT of dash users happy!

20 (edited by demarks51 2017-08-09 13:47:50)

Re: Disappointed

So do you now agree with my comments a while back?

"I would appeal to the Dash Depressants to just grow up."

I think if you read what they were posting before the crash, you could see this coming. Ungratefulness is pretty ugly.

Duane should be thanked for his amazing efforts to make the Dash even work at this time.

Chumbyites had to go through using the stub service and then Duane got it back to better than before. What can he do now? If there is only gripes, the motivation to strive for improvements could be hard to come by.

Personally, I truly think Duane is a  real gentleman!

Update from above comment:
Remember the Thread Title: Disappointed. That says a lot.

Update 2 after reading some other current posts:
There does seem to be a lot of  people who are very grateful for the ChumDash rescue. This "disappointment" may just be a small group of ones with very high expectations at this point. May I soften my statement to read:
Could you please show appreciation first and then make your suggestions for improvements? I have never felt that Duane has a problem with constructive criticism.

BTW: Duane, where are you spending the millions you are making from BlueOcty? Haven't seen your new ride yet. smile

Re: Disappointed

OK, I think we need to step back a bit, I'm not particularly comfortable with the tone of this thread in general.

Diamaunt (fortunately, or unfortunately, depending upon your point of view) had a very close view of watching how this whole sausage-making process was done, and is somewhat naturally protective of me and the work, so I can understand his frustration.  There was a lot of stuff that went on behind the scenes that the vast bulk of you didn't have to see, but he did - you were presented with a relatively painless installation process that completely hides the technical complexity that got to where we are.  Some of you may have even looked at the mechanism we used and it might even seem deceptively simple - however, the path to get to that simplicity was not straight at all, since we had to figure out how to get into the device in the first place.  There were a couple of serious show-stoppers that we had to overcome and it wasn't clear several times if we could pull this off.

Even worse, Sony threw us a curve by releasing a firmware update that seriously jeopardized the entire project, and we had to pretty much start over to figure out how to get around that too, which set the schedule back.  We've unbricked thousands of dashes over the past couple of weeks.

Just as happened with the chumby relaunch three years ago, this solution is not going to be perfect for everyone.  We accept that.  What I do want to make sure of is that we're properly setting expectations given the circumstances.

If you've found some other solution that works better for you, please use it with my blessings.  I won't be offended.

Sony had several years and lots of people and money to put together the themes you were all using.  The "default" theme that a lot of you were using had approximate 2.5MB of Actionscript source code, on top of the Flash graphics.  The size of the final theme SWF file is actually larger than the Control Panel itself.  It's basically a project of a magnitude comparable to the Control Panel.

As I don't have all those people, or some time-slowing device to pack all that development into just a few months, you will have to be patient, or find some alternative.  You may never get exactly what you think you want, and there may be several reasons why that may be the case -  not least of which is the economics of the entire chumby ecosystem.

To date, *chumby* subscribers have financed what you're currently using on the dash.  There is no nebulous deep pool of venture capital that makes this all work - people like you paid for this.  Some of you have donated, and some of you have subscribed, and I truly appreciate that.  However, if the plan is to withhold financial support until you get exactly what you want, that's probably not going to work out very well.  I have responsibilities to my other chumby users that *are* paying, and frankly, a couple of very important things I was working on for them were put on hold in order to devote all my available time to this project, and they've been extremely understanding about it.

Now that that rant is done, I think we will put together a FAQ that deals more directly with some of these issues, as I think that jhonryan has made some very solid points about that.

In any case, with all of your help, I'd like to keep the conversation civil in keeping with a longstanding tradition of this forum.

Re: Disappointed

What Duane was able to release more than met my expectations and I'm amazed at some of the feedback.  What we have now is a whole lot better than the Sony "brick".  On top of that we may see some continuing development that will make it even better.

What more could we possibly have expected.  As far as I know nobody provided a wish list together with a bunch of development money to make the wish list come true.  Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.

Thanks Duane, from at least one very happy Dash owner.

23 (edited by Bron 2017-08-09 18:39:43)

Re: Disappointed

Duane wrote:

OK, I think we need to step back a bit, I'm not particularly comfortable with the tone of this thread in general.

...

...

In any case, with all of your help, I'd like to keep the conversation civil in keeping with a longstanding tradition of this forum.


First, I was ecstatic to have my ChumDash up and running and there were many, many others in the thread "It's working!" who expressed similar satisfaction. I, too, was shocked to see this thread. Wow.  After all you did for us Sony Dash users who were abandoned...but some people have different views, so que sera, sera.

I was quite happy with the new layout. Is it the be all and end all? Maybe not, but it's pretty darn good and it works and we all know there's more to come down the road.  Actually, I would be pretty happy with just this for my $3 a month vs. a non-functional Dash setting in the closet.

So, 1) please don't let a few sour notes spoil the symphony, and 2) understand that 99.9% of those here are very grateful for your work.

Personally, I was reminded of the "good old days" when this sort of rescue was much more common. These days it is a rarity. As a retired sw developer, I understand the work that goes into something like this. I'm sure many others here do as well.

Please keep that in mind and thanks again for my new ChumDash!

Re: Disappointed

demarks51 wrote:

So do you now agree with my comments a while back?

Respectfully, no.

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

Re: Disappointed

Duane, if that is a "rant" it is the most polite rant I have ever read. The old saw "You can please some of the people all of the time, all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time" still holds true. I have a bit of an understanding of what it took to pull this off. Long ago I actually wrote a bit of code. That was a lifetime ago but I remember how difficult it could be. Throw in a tight time frame, an unfriendly device, and Sony being Sony, and you pulled off a minor miracle. I understand diamaunt's frustration. Some people will never be satisfied no matter how hard you work. They do not know or understand what it took to get where we are today. All they know is what they no longer have. They purchased an expensive device and it doesn't work the way they are used to it working. The Sony Dash will never be the same. Some will say it is better, some will say it is worse, and some will say it is just different. For those who don't like where the Dash is going, there is the Market (https://forum.chumby.com/viewforum.php?id=31) or Ebay. Everyone needs to keep things in the proper perspective and try to see things from different points of view. We are a community. Some of us have been here a long time and some are new. Like having new neighbors who are from a different city/state/country, there will be an adjustment period. In the long run the community will be stronger.

Tar, feathers, congress. Some assembly required.