Topic: MS Zune
Is there any possibility of adding support for the Zune along with the Ipod? I would like to be able to plug my Zune in and play music thru the chumby.
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MS Zune
chumbysphere forum → Chumby, the Device → MS Zune
Posts: 15
- shoe
- Chum
- Offline
Re: MS Zune
I don't know how likely that would be,,, I'm quoting Duane from July 7th on the blog here:
Unfortunately, the Zune uses proprietary Microsoft formats and transfer protocols, and everything’s wrapped in DRM, so no Zune support.
Some of the Creative devices are also using proprietary Microsoft protocols (MTP), so we’d have to take a hard look at that.
Given Microsoft’s recent sabre-rattling with regard to software patents, we’re highly reluctant to incorporate anything that would get their lawyers worked up - so, I’m afraid the chumby’s going to have to be Microsoft-free for the moment.
I don't know if anything's changed (although the first 'nix patent infringement lawsuit came yesterday, I saw on some RSS feed on my chumby).
I have an older Zen Nomad/Touch (uses both MTP and the older protocol), but I know when I try to load it in any Linux program and accidently click on a file with DRM, the program locks up and the Zen chokes. I would be a little nervous about what that would do to my chumby.
I'm holding out hope I can get my Slimserver router problems figured out, or at least that someone develops a widget to easily plug a USB drive full of music in the chumby, mount it, and play through the chumby interface that way.
shoe
- derspiess
- Chum
- Offline
Re: MS Zune
Just bought a Zune myself (and love it) & would like to see this as well, but I'm afraid Zune's market share would likely make Chumby compatibility not worth the effort. AFAIK, nobody has gotten a Zune to play nice with Linux itself (I guess you could install XP on a virtual machine but that kinda defeats the purpose).
I'd just be happy if you could play music from a USB drive, per shoe's post. Ditto for flash-based video.
But hey, these things haven't even hit the mass market yet, so I guess I can be patient 
Chumby birthdate: 10/11/07
Re: MS Zune
Well to access the Zune on Linux you'd probably have to use libmtp, but it doesn't look like they can authenticate yet so there's no playing of songs, just listing.
I'm not at all the person to attempt this, but if someone could get libmtp working on a Chumby that would be the best step for supporting other players that use MTP.
But it would still not give us Zune playback.
- Duane
- Blue Octy
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Re: MS Zune
Zune support will probably *never* happen on the chumby - between the DMCA and Microsoft's technical and legal barriers, we can't support it without soliciting Microsoft's help and closing the system (technically and legally) from any type of user modification.
Re: MS Zune
Would it be possible to make a widget that could play music from my PC via Wifi? I would really like to play music on it.
- RhythmGuru
- First 50
- Offline
Re: MS Zune
kgeissler, check the Chumby WIKI. There is a way to stream music from your PC wirelessly using a few easy hacks and running the slimserver program on your PC.
"We will find a way, or we will make one."
Re: MS Zune
I am a long time Chumby fan - finally got mine (1st one came with LCD cracked :-( It's great! Lovin' it.
As far as Zune goes - I have a Zune as well as Sonos (www.sonos.com). At first Sonos did not offer Zune compatibility due to MSFT's restrictions... however the finally did work it out because now Zune works with Sonos! I hope the same happens with Chumby... although I don't find myself using it for music so much.
- Duane
- Blue Octy
- Offline
Re: MS Zune
Is the Sonos an Open system? Therein lies the problem - getting Microsoft to license their DRM technology under a license that's compatible with the chumby's Open ecosystem.
I'm not sure we want to close the system just to support the Zune.
Re: MS Zune
Duane wrote:
Is the Sonos an Open system? Therein lies the problem - getting Microsoft to license their DRM technology under a license that's compatible with the chumby's Open ecosystem.
I'm not sure we want to close the system just to support the Zune.
While Sonos' Zone Players do run on Linux with a proprietary 802.11x wireless mesh network they are not an "open" architecture but I do know a number of folks have been able to create some cool tools to interact with the system... However I do understand what you mean with regard to the Chumby's Open eco-system and MSFT not playing nice with those types of licenses... How is it that Apple is more open than MSFT? Isn't the iPod architecture closed?
- Duane
- Blue Octy
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Re: MS Zune
dstrack wrote:
How is it that Apple is more open than MSFT? Isn't the iPod architecture closed?
All of the iPods prior to the Touch and iPhone simply mount as USB mass storage devices. The database that stores the information about the tracks has been successfully reverse engineered for years. We have obtained the necessary licenses from the various third-party licensing authorities to play the bulk of the unprotected music, because Apple mosty uses industry standard formats - MP3, and M4A/AAC.
In other words, to play most of the music from the iPod does not require any cooperation from Apple. We *would* have to obtain a license from somebody to play some of the more obscure formats (Apple Lossless, Audible, etc) or to play DRM'd tracks from the iTMS. This would, of course, result in us raising the price to offset the cost of the license fees, and close the system in order to protect the DRM subsystem.
On the other hand, the Zune mostly uses a Microsoft proprietary format, everything ends up wrapped in DRM even if the source material isn't, and it even uses a proprietary USB protocol, all wrapped up in tasty patented frosting. You really can't make a more hostile device from a development standpoint.
Re: MS Zune
Ah makes sense... I hadn't thought about the USB mass storage device capability that the Zune lacks... Thanks for the explanation!
Re: MS Zune
@Duane:
Wouldn't a clean-room reverse engineering be free of the licensing and patent problems? If so, then libmtp which is used in gnomad, amongst other things, should work like a charm. Of course, WMA playback would be a different story, but if there were MP3s on the Nomads, Dell DJs, etc., then they could be read and played back.
- Duane
- Blue Octy
- Offline
Re: MS Zune
A "clean room" implementation would get around copyright issues, but not patent issues.
With patents, *any* implementation that embodies the patented technology, would be in violation.
One problem is that it's not clear whether or not MTP actually includes any Microsoft patents. I do know when I was with a company that attempted to get the formal documentation from Microsoft, the company was required to agree to a license that precluded development of any code to be released under a copyleft license such as the GPL.
As you know, Microsoft has made public allegations against Linux with regard to patents. At this point, we're being relatively conservative, and keeping any obviously Microsoft-proprietary technologies *out* of the "official" chumby ecosystem.
That does not, however, preclude any third party from creating such software for the chumby, especially in jurisdictions where such patents do not apply.
Re: MS Zune
Duane wrote:
With patents, *any* implementation that embodies the patented technology, would be in violation.
Crap, that's right - and I took IP law classes too. Is it all the case that a company like Fluendo would be able to provide such a licence if individual users were willing to pay for it?
Posts: 15
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