Topic: When will the update be released?

Any possibility of getting a better ETA than "Soon"?  Like "August," "September," etc.  Not that any of us are anxious......   :-)

Re: When will the update be released?

Tburg wrote:

Any possibility of getting a better ETA than "Soon"?  Like "August," "September," etc.  Not that any of us are anxious......   :-)

There are two factors in play (that I know of):
1) Sony must fully shut down their servers first
2) Duane must finish debugging the new software

Bugs are being squashed and I have not heard of any major issues with the software. "Soon" is as good as it gets for the software.

Sony isn't saying when they will pull the plug. The only date they gave was "July".

Tar, feathers, congress. Some assembly required.

3 (edited by alaric11 2017-07-26 08:24:05)

Re: When will the update be released?

BoloMKXXVIII wrote:

1) Sony must fully shut down their servers first
2) Duane must finish debugging the new software

If that is so and Sony decides to let their servers run for another year or longer, annoying the Dash owners to death with their forced update screen, the only solution to keep using the Dash will be the firewall rules, right?

Unfortunately I am an owner of a rather dumb German Telekom router which is not capable of formulating such elaborate rules as "only disallow servers from a certain IP range". So I can either run the Dash without ANY internet connection or keep it turned off.

I was really hoping Duane would release the chumbification also if the Sony servers continue to operate. Is there any chance for that?

Re: When will the update be released?

Tburg wrote:

Any possibility of getting a better ETA than "Soon"?  Like "August," "September," etc.  Not that any of us are anxious......   :-)

Artificial deadlines for software result in inferior products.

That said, I'm *hoping* for July, but it's not up to me.

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

Re: When will the update be released?

alaric11 wrote:
BoloMKXXVIII wrote:

1) Sony must fully shut down their servers first
2) Duane must finish debugging the new software

If that is so and Sony decides to let their servers run for another year or longer, annoying the Dash owners to death with their forced update screen, the only solution to keep using the Dash will be the firewall rules, right?

Unfortunately I am an owner of a rather dumb German Telekom router which is not capable of formulating such elaborate rules as "only disallow servers from a certain IP range". So I can either run the Dash without ANY internet connection or keep it turned off.

I was really hoping Duane would release the chumbification also if the Sony servers continue to operate. Is there any chance for that?

You can always get another router and set up another wifi access point with it.

As to chances, Duane will have to weigh in.

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

Re: When will the update be released?

alaric11 wrote:
BoloMKXXVIII wrote:

1) Sony must fully shut down their servers first
2) Duane must finish debugging the new software

Unfortunately I am an owner of a rather dumb German Telekom router which is not capable of formulating such elaborate rules as "only disallow servers from a certain IP range". So I can either run the Dash without ANY internet connection or keep it turned off.

Does your router support static routes?  If so, you can set up the IPs to point to gateway that doesn't exist.  My router doesn't support blocking a range of IPs but it *DID* support static routes.  I just set the IPs affected to the Sony lowest IP (or dot zero if you like) and matched the /19 of the subnet (translated to 255.255.224.0). 

You can probably find a subnet calculator out there somewhere.

Hope that helps.

Re: When will the update be released?

Well, I suspect that Sony's plan at the moment is to leave the servers up in their current form for some time in the hopes that people will power up their devices months from now and will accept their firmware update.

This leaves us in an awkward position.

Once I release the chumby software, Sony will be able to figure out how we did it. Sony *may* choose to replace their update so that devices that are *not* running our stuff will not be able to use it.

On the other hand, we can't sit on this forever - people want to use their devices.

My guess is that we'll release despite the Sony servers still being alive.

We basically have all major bugs fixed but one, I put out a new beta last night for the testers.   I will make a decision on whether to release shortly.

Re: When will the update be released?

Duane wrote:

I will make a decision on whether to release shortly.

Poor Shortly!  Please release him!

Re: When will the update be released?

laughing ostrich cut away

Re: When will the update be released?

Duane wrote:

...
This leaves us in an awkward position.

Once I release the chumby software, Sony will be able to figure out how we did it. Sony *may* choose to replace their update so that devices that are *not* running our stuff will not be able to use it.

On the other hand, we can't sit on this forever - people want to use their devices.

My guess is that we'll release despite the Sony servers still being alive.

...

I strongly support the decision to release despite the Sony servers still going.
For you it's a tradeoff between the potential subscribers you could loose by Sony figuring out how the chumbification works and countering that in a future update and the loss of momentum the "killer" update created.
I believe the latter is much worse than the former.
I certainly am in the mood to subscribe as soon as I have seen my dash alive again.

And I DON'T want to buy an additional WLAN access point to be able to set firewall rules just so the Dash can survive with the Sony software still on it. In that case I'd rather switch to some other device :-D
(That said I have to agree it's a shame what German Telekom gives you for a router)

Re: When will the update be released?

Sony will have to leave the update servers going for a long time, otherwise, people could simply turn off their Dash's, wait until then, and simply run it without the update.

Re: When will the update be released?

The Dash will not come up in anything other than default clock mode without going through the authentication process or having the Blue Octy software available to redirect to the Chumby servers.  Since this gets it off Sony's servers I can't imagine why they would do anything to prevent the "hack".

At this point Sony would be in a rather precarious legal position if the Chumbification is released and they do something to block it. THAT is a deliberate, malicious act compared to sloppy programming of the EOL update.  I don't see their legal department giving it a thumbs-up, but I've seen corporations do stupider things.

I vote release it and deal with whatever Sony does, if anything.

Re: When will the update be released?

I would not wait for Sony.  They have stated they are no longer supporting to the device and if they aren't supporting it, I can't see what resources that they would justify using to make a firmware update just to break the work-around.

However, I'd also rather not rush things either.  Take your time and continue to put the high-quality focus and care you have already been putting into the project.  I'd rather wait another week, 2 weeks, or month without functionality and have an amazing and stable device than to have the release rushed and have bugs.  I understand there aren't many bugs as-is, however, it's always best to take the time to test and get things right.  smile

Re: When will the update be released?

joshuahist wrote:

Sony will have to leave the update servers going for a long time, otherwise, people could simply turn off their Dash's, wait until then, and simply run it without the update.

It doesn't work that way, without a server on the other end, the dash will just sit there and try to download a control panel... It'll function as a clock, but any touch or button press will cause it to try to download that non existent cp.... You won't even be able to correct the time on the clock.

Cleaning up any loose bits and bytes.

Re: When will the update be released?

riblet2000 wrote:

The Dash will not come up in anything other than default clock mode without going through the authentication process or having the Blue Octy software available to redirect to the Chumby servers.  Since this gets it off Sony's servers I can't imagine why they would do anything to prevent the "hack".

At this point Sony would be in a rather precarious legal position if the Chumbification is released and they do something to block it. THAT is a deliberate, malicious act compared to sloppy programming of the EOL update.  I don't see their legal department giving it a thumbs-up, but I've seen corporations do stupider things.

I vote release it and deal with whatever Sony does, if anything.

I agree. My guess is that SONY really does not give a damn one way or the other. They just want to be rid of the support costs. I suspect they'll leave their servers up until someone there asks "Can I use this box for something else?" and their boss says "Sure, why not."

I really don't think they're putting too much thought into this. So I would think the risk of them trying to jam-up the fix is low. I sure hope so, anyway. In my opinion, the only reason the Dash units were saved last year was because a techie there took pity and fixed the problem. I doubt if there was even much discussion there about it. Afterwards, it bubbled up to management (still just guessing) and they said, what? We still support those things. Waste of money. Get rid of them.

So unless there's some funky legal issue, I don't think they will really care one way or the other.

16 (edited by NOS4A2 2017-07-26 14:53:05)

Re: When will the update be released?

Duane wrote:

Well, I suspect that Sony's plan at the moment is to leave the servers up in their current form for some time in the hopes that people will power up their devices months from now and will accept their firmware update.

This leaves us in an awkward position.

Once I release the chumby software, Sony will be able to figure out how we did it. Sony *may* choose to replace their update so that devices that are *not* running our stuff will not be able to use it.

On the other hand, we can't sit on this forever - people want to use their devices.

My guess is that we'll release despite the Sony servers still being alive.

We basically have all major bugs fixed but one, I put out a new beta last night for the testers.   I will make a decision on whether to release shortly.

Assuming we know Sony's server names (or IPs) won't be possible to block any incoming/outcoming connection by updating the hosts file and/or iptables or equivalent (assuming there's one)?

Re: When will the update be released?

NOS4A2 wrote:

Assuming we know Sony's server names (or IPs) won't be possible to block any incoming/outcoming connection by updating the hosts file and/or iptables or equivalent (assuming there's one)?

The issue is not the devices we would control, but rather the ones out in the rest of the world that may not have discovered us yet.

Once the chumby software is installed, this is no longer an issue, since we shut down the Sony middleware that's doing this - unless it's deinstalled or the user performs a factory reset without immediately reinstalling.

Re: When will the update be released?

I see the dilemma, but it seems open ended for as long as Sony chooses to keep a server port active.   Given that Sony has ceased official support, any further firmware changes to defeat users from salvaging their hardware by installing alternate firmware might rise to some kind of tortious intereference with what is now, unquestionably, privately owned and abandoned hardware.